Blue: "In boxing history there have been some great rivalries down through the years but one rivalry stands out above all the others in boxing history and in sports history, Ali-Frazier. The two men had a dislike for each other with Ali’s taunts getting under Frazier’s skin and this led to three ferocious fights between the pair and even to this day they both swap insults at each other some thirty five years after their first bout.

 

In the lead up to their first fight Ali had come back from his three year exile with victories over Quarry and Bonevena and had never lost the title he won against Sonny Liston in the ring. Ali said since his title had never been taken from him in the ring he should be recognised as the true heavyweight champion of the world. During Ali’s exile Joe Frazier beat Jimmy Ellis for the title that had been stripped off Ali for his refusal to fight in the Vietnam war. So going into their fight both had legitimate claims to be called the heavyweight champion of the world. This led to the most anticipated fight in boxing history and was dubbed “fight of the century”. The fight itself more than lived up to its billing with an awesome performance from both fighters in the ring with Frazier scoring a knockdown in the last round and he took the decision after fifteen breathtaking rounds. After the fight Ali’s face was more marked than in any of his previous bouts with the whole right side of his face swollen courtesy of Frazier’s powerful left hook. Frazier who won the fight was in such bad condition that he spent nearly three months in hospital rehabilitating. This fight got the attention and interest of people who normally wouldn’t watch boxing and coupled with Frazier and Ali’s difference in personality and ring style took boxing to a new level.

 

During the time between their first and second bout, Frazier lost the title to Foreman and Ali won and lost to Ken Norton. Ali had been goading Frazier to get back into the ring with him ever since his defeat in the first fight and it made sense for them to fight each other again now with the winner to go on to face Foreman in a match for the heavyweight title. In the build up to this fight both Ali and Frazier went on a talk show to hype their rematch. While watching highlights of their first fight, Ali repeatedly taunted Frazier. Joe was stung by the criticism and Ali’s quick wit angered him to the point were he left his seat and faced up to Muhammad. Joe asked him why he was picking on him and Ali stood up and a brawl took place, which needed both fighters to be restrained. The second fight was also a great fight and is sometimes overlooked because the title wasn’t at stake and it didn’t quite reach the level of their first and third fight. Ali got his revenge in this fight and nearly stopped Frazier in the second only for the referee to end the round by early by mistake when Joe was in trouble. The break in action allowed Frazier the time he needed to gather himself together. Frazier fought his way back into the fight but Ali took the decision after the twelve rounds. Frazier protested at Ali’s holding and clinching during the fight and felt he should have got the verdict.

 

They were now one win apiece and I will discuss how the level of hate grew outside the ring and also their third fight, the most brutal in boxing history in the next round. Barrera and Morales may have been the best rivals in the last ten years of boxing but looking back on the sport as a whole there were no two men with the rivalry of Ali-Frazier"
 

Ryno? How many fingers am I holding up?
Ryno:

Red: "I will start by ripping your whole argument to pieces. Your first round is full of contradictions and some points that are just plain wrong. If you picked Winky Wright as one of the most ducked and avoided fighters before the Vargas fight then you would have had a point. You say nobody wants to fight him but in his very next fight he is going up against Jermain Taylor who is recognised as the middleweight champion following his wins over Hopkins. Hardly facing a nobody now is he. Another reason you say why Wright is getting ducked is because of his normally unexciting style but then why is Margarito getting ducked when he is one of the, if not the most exciting fighters in the world today.

 

 You wrote that fighters don’t want to go up against him because they think they will be out boxed over the twelve rounds and get frustrated at times when they cant land many punches. This type of defeat may hurt their ego and they can also use the excuse that Wright’s style was too tricky for them. When a fighter loses to Margarito they can have no excuses because he stands in front of them and literally beats beats them up before normally knocking them out. This is the worst type of defeat for a fighter when they get beaten up for a few rounds and then knocked out. Normally fighters are not the same after these types of defeats and this is the reason you don’t hear any of the big names calling Margarito out, as their career unlike a defeat to Wright may never be the same again.

 

I agree that Wright is a top fighter and thought he beat Vargas by a couple of points, not a clear-cut victory as you say. Against Mosely he won clearly the first time, but the second fight most people felt was very close and not “rather easy” as you said. The question is not who is the better fighter but who is being ducked and avoided more. To tackle another of your points you said after he beat Mosely for the second time “it put the seal on the deal” for other fighters to avoid him. Do you actually know that in his very next fight he fought Felix Trinidad who at the time was the hottest property in boxing following his demolition of Mayorga. Tito had no reason to take the Wright fight and this again is another example of Wright not being avoided. The reason Wright is being ranked so high at the moment is because of his performances against some of the big names in the sport. Margarito is not getting the same opportunities as he is being avoided by all the top fighters around his weight class at the moment who are quite happy to mention each other’s names but you never hear the name Margarito.

 

You also claim that Margarito was ducking Wright, which is again wrong. As you can see from the picture below Wright and Margarito met at a boxing event. This was just before Winkys second fight with Mosely and he gave Antonio his word that he would fight him next. As I said before, the Trinidad fight then came about for Wright and Margarito was once again left in the dark. It was not Margarito backing out of a fight with Wright that stopped this fight from happening but Wright going after bigger money, so your misinformed yet again.

 

The point that kills your argument off completely was when you said Wright has barely a recognised name on his record. What??? He has fought Harry Simon and then a couple of fights later Fernando Vargas. They were both losses but then after rebuilding has gotten the big fights. In fact there have not been many other fighters who have taken on the level of competition that Wright has over the last three years, Mosely twice, Trinidad and Taylor in his next fight. This is not the record of the most avoided fighter currently active but the record of a fighter who is taking on bigger names than maybe anyone else in the sport at the moment. Even if he loses to Taylor, it should be close, he will get an immediate rematch or if he wins, as is the most likely outcome then he can look forward to plenty more big fights over the next couple of years. All the time Margarito waits frustrated as big name after big name refuses to fight him. He is without question the worlds most avoided fighter. If this response hasn’t at least got you seeing stars then it has you in a deep sleep."
 

Killer, was he just too much for you?
The Killer:

Travis, give us your thoughts on this fight and how soon will you be back?
Travis Landon: